Council hears opposition to Fayette Junction plan
Tuesday night’s City Council meeting started out festive enough. Several members of the council were wearing purple in honor of the Fayetteville Bulldogs Congratulation Resolution, which recognized the FHS men’s and women’s basketball teams for winning dual state championships.
The mayor even issued a proclamation, naming Tuesday, April 6, 2009 as FHS Bulldog and Lady Bulldog basketball day.
Then, approval of the Amberwood Place development, which is set along Double Springs and Dot Tipton Road, easily passed through the council, earning praise from aldermen for the innovative design and use of green space.
But the meeting hit a kerfuffle when the Fayette Junction Master Plan was brought before the council. Members of the public who approached the microphone spoke vehemently against the master plan, saying it will take away land from private owners, among other complaints.
Fayette Junction is in southwest Fayetteville and the new plan for the area will serve to link the existing developments in the area, according to the Planning Commission’s website. The design for the 640-acre neighborhood is set for dense population in the area, enough to support a light rail system.
Back in September of 2008, more than 100 citizens participated in a “charrette” to provide input from the public on what they wanted the space to look like. However, it is clear that some stakeholders in the area are not happy with the proposal.
“This is a way that government eventually takes property away from private citizens,” Nathan Ogden said. His family owns land in the area, which is zoned as C-2 commercial. With the new plan, the area will be characterized as “urban zoning district.”
Another citizen dismissed the plans altogether, calling the sketches for the area “cartoons” and “phony-baloney zoning.”
After a couple rounds of public comment, the council decided to table the issue until the next meeting so that members of the public could meet with the Planning Commission to assuage concerns.
Comments
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Sardon
April 8, 2009
The Ogdens got their property (the old trailer park at 265 and 540) rezoned many years ago. It was a speculative rezoning, and they’re still waiting for somebody to buy it and build a big truck stop or something. I don’t know what urban zoning is, but it probably allows fewer options than C-2 (think College Ave.).
I particularly detest this kind of greed. It’s a “damn the public good” attitude, when the property would not have any value if not for public investment. If the major roads, water and sewer, fire and police, etc. had not been built/provided with the neighbors tax contributions, the land would be virtually as worthless as the Ogdens property near Hogeye.
Slippery slope takings arguments make me want to beat the **** out of the greedy liar spouting that bull****.
Matthew Petty
April 8, 2009
Actually, the urban zoning district includes all of the uses already allowed on their property, and then some. It would make their land more valuable.
We should have passed it last night. It’s only a concept plan. There are no rules or rezonings associated with it.
roger
April 8, 2009
This has nothing to do with the post but this problem is, and will be happening a lot more often from now on…yeah, unfortunately i think fayetteville is headed in a bad direction. there should be a cap on growth at some point, shouldn’t there? i’m a novice, so that’s just a guess.
the city was about to tear down some pretty amazing houses on spring street to make way for more parking, until they decided to build a bigger city deck. i’m guessing eventually the city will buy the houses for most likely a fraction of what they are worth. i would hate to be a homeowner in the historical district or near wilson park, let’s put it that way.
Matthew Petty
April 8, 2009
Roger, I think that was the county, not the city.
RE: growth. I’m considering an urban growth boundary, but I don’t think we should limit the number of people moving here. Besides mobility being one of the foundations of democracy, I’d rather have people live in a place that is trying to tackle sprawl and other sustainability issues than have people live in a place that doesn’t care – for the sake of our commonwealth resources.
Tony Wappel
April 8, 2009
Residents of Fayette Junctions Beware. No matter which side you were on with the charettes in Fayette Junction, the plan may not stick. It’s less than a year old and the planning department is already recommending changes to the Walker Park Neighborhood Master Plan. (See Fayeteville Speaks comments on Stick to the Plan for more information.)
Unknown City Worker
April 9, 2009
Whether someone is holding out for an investment they made in their property to be fulfilled is not really something you can put at a lower scale than some dreamed-up vision that may or may not work exactly as planned.
What Sardon seems to be saying is that because of his perceived idea of the greater good being that of the public, that a individual has no rights.
Where does it stop if that is the reasoning we measure by? Already as several amazing people brave enough to speak the truth about the rules of order that our government practices by is less than honest.
I have seen it over and over at each of these meetings. Putting off a vote seems like the right thing to do, makes the opposition actually believe they have a chance to say their peace and maybe they do, but this is not what has happened for the majority of past items.
Politicians are sneaky that way. By postponing the vote they don’t have to make citizens angry if they vote the other way. The press would love to catch after reactions to something like that if it occured. By tabling it they know time and time again most citizens give up, don’t attend second or third meetings.
Good ideas are not great just because they look pretty on paper and someone tells you so. There are reasons though people want you to believe their idea is the right way to go. Anyway you look at their idea it will always be questionable, no surefire, solid, 100% success answer. But a great way for those running the government to spend your money, take your investment away from you all in the name of progress.
Sardon
April 9, 2009
Matt, thanks for clearing up that this fancy new “urban zoning” would allow anything allowed in C-2 and then some. I hope you got a chance to splain that to Ogden and he understands he has nothing to fear.
City worker, I guess that you’re new on the job, and I know you cannot communicate effectively in writing and your reading comprehension is pitiably lacking. Your interpretations of the actions of elected officials is wrong, probably because you haven’t been watching for long. Tabling an item allows for more opportunity for the opposition to organize and to speak again. The opposite of what you think. I think, it’s hard to tell what you think from your shabby writing.
Individuals have plenty of rights, but my right to swing my fist ends at your nose. Ask somebody in the Planning Department to tell you the story of the Tragedy of the Commons. And take Freshman English.
a. brown
April 9, 2009
*COUGH* ad hominem *COUGH*
roger
April 9, 2009
the planning dept. is new in town, and angry people lived here before them,apparently. most people planning fayetteville think brandon barber is a longtime resident.
roger
April 9, 2009
i forgot to say gohogs
roger
April 9, 2009
ps -sardon
too many prepositional phrases,my guess is you were a business major
a. brown
April 9, 2009
Also, Sardon, it is not only college-educated folks who get a say in what happens in their town. College can’t teach you everything, and obviously it doesn’t reform pr*cks.
George
April 9, 2009
@Sardon – Hmm. You come across kind of d&%kheadish. First of all, what’s up with the grammar police? UCW writes just fine and gets his points across from my interpretation. It’s a discussion, not an English paper. If it was a paper you’d likely get points deducted for sentence fragments and comma misuse (oh the shame!).
Second, Nathan Ogden is a stand up guy. Sure he has a vested interest here, but he also has a right to protect that interest. It’s easy to condemn someone for a perceived “damn the public good” attitude when it’s not your investment on the line. I don’t know all the ins and outs of this issue. I do trust that Mr. Ogden is not the kind of person to start running off at the mouth without doing his homework.
Why so angry? Sounds like you have an agenda.
Sardon
April 9, 2009
Yeah, George, my agenda is a better Fayetteville that develops the way the people who live here, even new people, want it to develop. I appreciate the people who take part in city government, but the wishes of those people often don’t matter because the City Council members too often base their votes on personal friendships rather than planning documents produced by public participation.
I don’t know Nathan Ogden and have nothing against him. It’s just that I’ve seen the same scene played out plenty of times before. A squeaky wheel (or a big wheel) gets his way rather than the City sticking to its plan. I thanked Matt for letting me, and I hope Nathan, know that he has nothing to fear from a plan that could revitalize south Fayetteville, which is so close to downtown, Dickson and the U. I’ve long lamented this neglected part of town being ignored while developers build sprawl. It would be more sustainable and economical and humane for all of us taxpayers and ratepayers to develop what we have instead of continuously annexing more land and laying more asphalt and pipes.
If Ogden has plans for dense development on his property, I’m all for it, but I’d like to see it agree with the plan that the people who care about the area created. I like mixed uses. Give me some different types of residential, a local bar, a corner bakery, a neighborhood grocer, and even a gas station, but a Little America mega truck stop would amount to condemnation of the surrounding land. A sort of private practical taking that guarantees south Fayetteville’s future as a slum.
Correct on the angry **** assessment George, but wrong on the business major, Roger.
BTW, I read in the paper today that in the Forbes deal where Fayetteville finished 4th nationally, we finished near the bottom in educational attainment. That surprised me and I could only partially explain it away by remembering that about a third of the population are still college students and don’t yet have degrees. I don’t think only people who have college degrees should have a say in public participation planning, and I don’t know where Brownie read that. People who show up and say something is who should have that say, not Johnny Come Lately absentee landlords with only personal financial interests.
a. brown
April 9, 2009
Making fun of people’s writing style and possible education is the mark of a classist pr*ck, and doesn’t do much to further anything.
Scott Stapp of Creed
April 9, 2009
What exactly is an “urban zoning district?” I don’t see that listed among all the other zoning districts in the City Code.
roger
April 9, 2009
I remember the idea of turning the old Jefferson School into a mixed use property, i think it would have been a good idea. I remember Cindy Arsaga was trying to get folks combine efforts to make it affordable, but it couldn’t come together… Not that I’m upset it’s now Adult education, but a smaller grocery store would have been nice. South Fayetteville ( i live there) is sandwiched between 2 iga’s so i guess i’m just being lazy….PS – the flyer should do a story about the awesomeness of Walker Park.
Sardon
April 9, 2009
Brownie, it didn’t hurt my feelings one bit when so many people complained about my sentence fragments and excessive use of whatever. I’m secure in my writing style and my sexuality. You seem to be buying into the Rush horsepuckey of the lower wage earners being the aggressors of the class war. Maybe the curse sensors blurred your reading.
Only you read some education snobbery, Read the lines instead of the alien brain waves. There really aren’t brain waves between the lines.
Scott, “urban zoning” doesn’t exist. It’s one of those concept things. Like a Rush Album. Like 2112.
George, I’ll read between your lines. This guy is a “stand up dude,” so I guess you’d behave just like the City Council and vote for your buddy (frat brah?) because you know he would do no wrong and if he did he’d share the wealth with you. The rest of us suffering to finance you.
Boggy Creek Creature
April 9, 2009
Total Bastard, where are you?!?
We miss you.
And we need you back to take this c@ck Sardon to task.
David Franks
April 10, 2009
Oh, Sardon is just being sardonic. Or mock-sardonic.
Oh, wait– “mock-sardonic” a bit redundant.
George
April 10, 2009
Listen D-Bag McGee. I don’t have any “frat brahs.” I knew the dude growing up. He’s just an old country boy like me. If you’re suffering, it’s not to finance me. Maybe you have daddy issues. I don’t know. I’m really not qualified to make that diagnosis.
You know, you were actually starting to make some sense and sound like a reasonable adult with your previous post. Then you had to go and show your ass again. Pity.
Sardon
April 10, 2009
George, just tell the truth. Do you think planning decisions that will cost all of us should be made on the basis of public participation crafted by professsionals into policy that is adopted by (hopefully honest) elected officials, or on whether the profiteer is a stand up old boy?
Forget it. You’ve already answered twice. Are you really Adella, or Brenda?
Sardon
April 10, 2009
I just realized that this thread has become a sociological experiment. I attack the corrupt “good old boy” system of government that keeps Arkansas 49th, which offends a “regular,” and several more regular good old boys on the blog attack and insult me in defense of their friend. Not only are the majority of you now defending the good old boy system, that very system is being exhibited by the blog.
I don’t contribute often enough to be one of you, so you stone the outsider for not being an insider, not for what he says.
David Franks is the only one of you who has shown any humor, and yes David, my full name is Sardon on Wry, after my favorite sandwich.
Matthew Petty
April 10, 2009
@Scott Stapp – The urban zoning district hasn’t been created yet, that’s why you don’t see it listed anywhere.
Scott Stapp of Creed
April 10, 2009
I apologize for my ignorance here (I haven’t seen the actual Plan), but they’re planning to rezone land to a zoning district that hasn’t been created yet?
Oh its on
April 15, 2009
Sardon, after everyone slammed you for being a pri-ck, only then did you try to play it off as humor. Please! The number of posts you put on this rag shows that your a troll.
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