Downtown parking resolutions gain council support
All three resolutions dealing with parking around Dickson Street passed overwhelmingly at Tuesday night’s city council meeting.
As at the agenda session, Mayor Lioneld Jordan and other staff members stressed that these measures did not set anything in stone, but were just a means to get the council’s intent on taking steps toward a parking plan for the entertainment district.
“Before myself and staff spends hours and hours and hours of developing something that may not pass this council,” Jordan said, “I want to make sure that we’re all on the same team bringing forward the process.”
Sharon Crosson, the city’s parking and telecommunications manager, said acquiring leases for the private parking lots would allow the city to manage the lots and bring continuity of parking enforcement to the downtown area, meaning cars would be ticketed rather than towed.
The second resolution described the intent to convert free public parking into paid parking lots. The money made from paid parking lots would enable city staff to enforce the parking regulations after hours, Crosson said.
“Not only does it generate revenue to build a future parking deck, it also puts another set of eyes and feet in the entertainment district to help with the litter control and to help with police officers,” she said.
Alderman Bobby Ferrell said he was in support of the parking ordinances, because in the face of a budget shortfall, this could lead to a revenue flow.
The third item established council intent for a residential parking permit for those who live in the neighborhoods around Dickson Street.
All three resolutions passed without a “no” vote.
Mary Robbins is a guest contributor for the Fayetteville Flyer. She declared Fayetteville as her hometown upon moving here for college. She is a Journalism graduate who enjoys live music, the outdoors and attending city council meetings. For more of Mary’s contributions, visit her author page.
Comments
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By Mark_Landry on December 2nd, 2009
As long as I don’t have to pay to park my bicycle, I’m still okay.
By Fat Boy on December 2nd, 2009
Thats Stupid!!!! We have several paid parking lots on Dickson street now, that sit mostly empty all weekend. People in this area, including myself, are not willing to pay for parking.
By Michael on December 2nd, 2009
Of course the council passed it, it’s another potential revenue stream for the city.
As has been said before, put a solid plan together with definite goals and time lines then put the issue up for a bond vote. Right now the various talking heads just keep saying “a portion will be used to improve Dickson Street” with no explanation on how much the portion will be or what the improvements will be.
By Offcamber on December 2nd, 2009
Michael’s assessment is a pretty tidy and succinct version of the commentary and tangents over the last week. Have to agree.
We should be a little stunned about the unanimous support of the council on all accounts. I read no report on their hesitation about the cost-benefit of leasing private lots, disservice to local businesses, harm to city tax intake from those businesses, and the hassles for local residents having to potentially acquire a permit to park in front of their own home.
Also, it’s an amusing tail-chase of a justification to charge for parking so that the City can afford to hire someone to enforce charging for parking. Beautiful bureaucracy in action.
Now that everyone agrees on pay parking, how long until more parking spaces are built?
By burgerboy on December 2nd, 2009
Everytime I hear Lioneld Jordan say “holistic approach” I snicker, as that was a catch phrase brought to local politics by Jordan’s competitor in the run-off, Dan Coody.
Also, wasn’t Gary Dumas allegedly fired because he proposed a parking plan for Dickson Street?
By Stuart on December 2nd, 2009
Listen people, the future is Pneumatic Tubes, you know, and I know it, we all know it. Cars are on the way out, we need to get with the times. Just look at what Pneumatic Tubes have done for the banking industry!
By mpetty on December 2nd, 2009
@Michael and Offcamber – Developing a detailed plan and using it to pass a bond to build a deck is exactly what we plan to do.
Everyone has it in their heads that we’re just here to screw it all up, but your suggestion echoes every conservation I’ve ever had about it, both online and in private meetings.
By Jessica on December 3rd, 2009
Great. Because what we really need in this city is another parking deck.
By Michael on December 3rd, 2009
Part of the reason people have it in their heads the city will screw it up, is because well honesty they usually do. When the city can consistently keep a project on time, on or under budget and deliver on promised improvements then people will stop expecting things to get screwed up.
By Misty on December 3rd, 2009
So, perhaps I’m way out of the loop, but don’t we already have a parking deck on Dickson? I thought the deck at Underwood Plaza was open to anyone wishing to park there. At any rate, I know it’s always empty, though perhaps that’s because of the availability of free parking elsewhere. There’s also the parking deck that serves the Legacy building, aka ‘The Monstrosity.’ I’m not sure if these spaces are open to the public, but I’m sure the city could ‘encourage’ the building’s owner to do so through tax breaks, etc. God knows it doesn’t have anything else going for it right now. I’m ambivalent about the institution of paid parking, but I’m definitely against defacing more public property with parking decks.
By Offcamber on December 3rd, 2009
Another parking deck is EXACTLY what Fayetteville needs, and done right this time.
NWA is the fast-growing seat of the state university and the world’s largest retailer. Fayetteville has the additional challenge of a haphazard street and parking arrangement dictated by terrain. Choose an increase in sprawl or an increase in building density. Fayetteville should set the example by building vertically.
Are parking decks beautiful? Not often, but they can be. In previous discussions, we’ve proposed commercial and residential frontage to mask the nuts and bolts. There are plenty of examples of fascinating, creative modern design, even in the second world. Fayetteville can solve the parking situation with an architectural gem (NOT another sea of red bricks, please) if it’s willing to pursue affordable, creative avenues. I mean, there’s a whole school for that up the hill that could help.
If anyone is sore over the presence of cars, sorry. Society isn’t taking back a century of self-propelled personal transportation that covers distance in all-weather speed and comfort. Fayetteville’s best bet is to continue to seek the business of people with cars.
By Offcamber on December 3rd, 2009
And to Petty’s statement, yeah, some of us aren’t expecting much greatness out of FayGov on these proposals.
If the discussion within the city has been about creating more parking spaces, it hasn’t been visible, and it certainly hasn’t matched everything reported to the public. Take the crooked scheme to give the WAC the big, free lot on West street that broke recently. In the grander sense, that would have meant turning over a lot owned by Fayetteville taxpayers to a private entity for their own profit and administration. In the last couple of weeks, the council has gone the *opposite* direction and used predatory private pay lot practices as justification for City-controlled pay parking. 180 degrees. I’m still baffled by this.
As mentioned above, Mayor Jordan fired Gary Dumas right after proposing his stinker all-pay City parking scheme. Less than a year later, the mayor and council are endorsing the same exact thing. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. Again, confusing and not very inspiring.
We’ve had FayGov asking for money with no set plan, or a nebulous, bad plan. One of the primary reason for the FHS millage failure was that it proposed a massive tax levy to fund an overpriced, freewheeling upgrade to an unrealistic site. It failed by popular vote, and not by a slim margin. It was ill-advised idealism, and it served as a setback to students and teachers at the cramped Stone Street facilities. Petty, around then you even stated, “I think…we need to raise taxes.”
What is the trend from the current mayor and council? Wanting more money from the people by any means without showing us any tangible progress, or even sound plans. That’s why some of us don’t have confidence in FayGov, and why this looks like a long, drawn-out screw-up in the making. For everyone who finds pride and enjoyment in the Dickson Street area, I would love to be proven wrong.
By Mark_Landry on December 3rd, 2009
The Underwood deck stays mostly empty…. that right there says we have *more* than enough parking.
I am in favor of making the current tow-mafia lots into ticket-not-tow. If the city can work that out with the churches, that will be a big improvement.
WWJT? (Who Would Jesus Tow?)
By DicksonBizOwner on December 3rd, 2009
I to was going to mention that there doesn’t seem to be a current parking crisis but that all kind of rolls into my observation about Dickson Street not being consistently busy. Again, I’m there until the late hours 4 nights per week and I park within a half block of my business 95% of the time. BBBQ and Halloween were the only recent exceptions.
By Mullva on December 3rd, 2009
@ Misty, just for clarification….the “monstrosity” has VERY limited parking. One of the main reasons the building has not sold very well is becasue it only has one parking space for the approximately 45 condos. In addition to the condos, there is room in that building for up to two restaraunts and a business on the backside ground floor. There are only 20 spaces to serve the other spaces beyond the condos. There is no extra spaces there.
Lack of foresight by the City Planning commision let this one get by!! After making most of the Dickson St. businesses/housing create 1.5 spaces for every so many rooms or patrons, and this one gets by without enough spots to support its own footprint, let alone additional spots.
By Mullva on December 3rd, 2009
As all of the lots move to a “Pay” status, I expect all of the Underwood spots to be filled. The free city lot in front of my house is always full after 5:00, but the pay lot 100 yards away will have spots expect for peak Thursday-Sunday nights and WAC events. The cheap folks will even park on curbs, sidewalks, or whereever just to aviod the parking fee. It is AMAZING to watch what people will do just to aviod $5!!!! If they cannot park closer than 1 whole block away from Dickson, it is a travesty!
Lately, the police have been handing out $75 tickets for parking ANYWHERE that is not an approved space!!
$5 doesn’t look like such a big deal in that light.
By Me on December 3rd, 2009
Great points Offcamber!
By burgerboy on December 3rd, 2009
Something else that needs to be considered during this parking debate:
One reason many people don’t want to park along side streets or far off of Dickson is because the area’s streets aren’t generally well lit.
Walking from Dickson to Block Street, which I have done more times than I can count, can seem a little bit risky for someone not familiar with the area.
Aside from a few highly publicized incidents last year (which turned out to be all inter-related to the same bunch of career criminals) the area is generally safe. Still, walking that area after dark feels a little unsafe because of how dark it is down there.
I’d like to see Block and maybe church revamped like Dickson and the square with wider sidewalks, landscaping and old-fashioned street lighting. There are still things that need to be done to encourage more walking between the Square and Dickson and the surrounding area.
The perception that the entire area is tied together that way will help people get used to walking from further distances than they are currently comfortable doing.
By David Franks on December 3rd, 2009
Thanks all for the good discussion.
By mpetty on December 3rd, 2009
@burgerboy – Block Ave is being redone next year.
@Michael – You could only be refering to the sewer plant, since every other project has been on-time and many have come in under budget. That includes the new Court building, College Ave improvements, Township improvements, the Library, and the list goes on and on and on. And when it comes to the sewer plant, once Coody fired the construction and engineering firm and brought everything in house, it too was on-time and even onbudget with the new estimates. Yeah, the new estimates were a lot higher, but that’s only because the original engineering firm was a bunch of shills. They never should have been hired.
You appear to just be cynical about government in general, but Fayetteville doesn’t fit the profile you present.
@Offcamber – Are you actually complaining that the involvement of the Council is leading to a better, more comprehensive parking proposal? It’s true that the Mayor probably should have talked with more people before making the announcement in October, but reality is that the Walton Arts Center is still getting exactly what they asked for. They never asked to receive all revenue for the lot, and it’s a shame that what they wanted wasn’t clearly articulated by City Hall to the public at the first announcement.
The Walton Arts Center wants to provide a customer service experience to their parking patrons during shows. They’re still going to do that, and they’re still going to get the revenue from doing that. They never intended to manage the lot when they weren’t having shows, other than to make sure people knew the lot needed to be cleared for their patrons when shows were going to happen.
So again, are you really complaining that the Council is insisting on a more comprehensive, more clearly articulated plan before moving forward? Because it sounds to me that the Council is doing exactly what you’re asking, and you’re too insensed to realize it.
And tell me exactly where we asked for money without a plan? We haven’t asked for any money at all!
And this isn’t really the place for it, but we do need to raise property taxes (and lower sales taxes or even HMR taxes). Don’t you realize you can deduct property taxes but you can’t deduct sales taxes? (Oh shiitake! He said ‘taxes’ again! And btw, I said ‘I think… it might be time to raise taxes’ not what you quoted me as saying, and what I did was ask for ideas that might be worthy of a tax increase.)
@Mullva – The Legacy has very limited parking at the building, but like all developments it was required to establish a Shared Parking Agreement with a nearby lot (like a church) to make up for it. I don’t know which lot they have their Shared Parking Agreement with, but I promise it exists.
@Everyone – Don’t mistake a relatively easy time now for what we will need in the future. That’s why this is called planning. And it doesn’t happen overnight. It’s going to take months to develop a good plan, and your input is required.
So, who has useful suggestions?
By MattPettysMushrooms on December 3rd, 2009
When will this comprehensive parking proposal be finalized? Will it move at the speedy pace of the sale barn rezoning issue?
By Mark_Landry on December 3rd, 2009
And where can I park my helicopter?
No one seems to have addressed that, I might just have to take my dollars to Bentonville.
By MattPettysMushrooms on December 3rd, 2009
You can park your copter b/w the Crystal Bridges and NEW Walton Art Center.
By brad on December 3rd, 2009
I think it’s a HORRIBLE idea by someone on city council to suggest removing the HMR tax. One of the things that makes Fayetteville a great place to live is Parks and Recreation. Where do you think we get the majority of the money for parks, concerts, kickball leagues, even some parks staff? Yep, the HMR tax. Every time you spend a dollar at a restaurant, $.01 goes to parks. If we get rid of this HMR, we are in a sense, putting the choke hold on parks and recreation. Not a good idea, Sr. Petty.
By burgerboy on December 3rd, 2009
I’d support a small property tax raise if it meant burying some powerlines around town, starting with the big fugly ones across Dickson. Yes, I am a homeowner.
I think some clearly defined capital improvements could be attached to any property tax proposal and they would pass. I wouldn’t mind paying an extra $100/yr if there were projects that would enhance our city in ways that would improve not only its day to day function for residents, but also its appeal to visitors and potential new entrepreneurs and industries.
A few specific examples (like powerlines, parking decks, or College Avenue enhancements) would demonstrate a vision for the city, and that would garner better support than a vaguely expressed need for additional revenue.
Powerlines are a good selling point, as long as the memories of the recent ice storm’s chaos are fresh. On my street, all of the neighbors were talking about it, and a few went ahead and paid to have their lines buries from the street after the storm debris was cleared.
By mpetty on December 4th, 2009
This is getting way off topic… @Brad – I’m well-aware of where HMR taxes go, and I would never suggest cutting Parks & Rec revenue. I would, however, consider reconfiguring the source of that revenue.
@MattPettysMushrooms – It will probably take three to six months to arrive at a plan the administration is comfortable presenting to the Council. That’s the nature of coordinating consensus among so many stakeholders.
By mpetty on December 4th, 2009
Oh, and one final thing @MattPettyMushrooms.
It’s pretty sensationalist to talk about the “NEW Walton Arts Center” in the context you are. They might expand north, but they’re never going to leave Fayetteville, either. They can exist throughout the region with multiple facilities and it’s not going to cause a rip in the space-time continuum.
By MattPettysMushrooms on December 4th, 2009
Did I say they were going to leave? The context is in your head. I said NEW. Which of course does imply “Old and Crappy” for the currently existing saltines box structure. Bring back the Bulls Eye!
You asked for useful suggestions: Get off the internets and make the parking thing happen in the 3 month range rather than the 6 month range. Seriously, start cutting back on your social media masturbating and focus on this parking thing. Fayetteville needs this now!
By anon on December 4th, 2009
@MattPettysMushrooms – While I’m sure you think you’re being clever with the name…you’re not. It’s just an ignorant form of irrelevant personal attack. Some of us appreciate the fact that members of our city government frequent mediums such as this to discuss issues, whether we agree with them or not.
Don’t be a douche.
By George on December 4th, 2009
I guess it’s kind of pointless to put “anon” with my Gravatar attached. LOL. Okay, it was me.
By Mark_Landry on December 4th, 2009
I was joking about the helicopter and taking my dollars to Bentonville.
Full disclosure:
I do not have a helicopter.
Or any dollars.
By David Franks on December 4th, 2009
George– I thought anon was the guy at the urinal next to you.
By mpetty on December 4th, 2009
@MattPettysMushrooms – I spend quite a bit of time meeting with folks in real life and spending time at City Hall working out issues. Using digital communities to communicate with citizens is not mutually exclusive with real life work.
Have you ever watched a meeting, phoned or emailed a representative, or shown up at City Hall to make a comment? Or do you think pressing Submit Comment with an anonymous name and a belligerent ‘tude is all you need to do to be a good citizen?
PS – I don’t think my Internet connection is big enough to masturbate with it. (Zing!) :P
By St Ambrose on December 4th, 2009
Just another brick in the wall — or another nail i the coffin — of Dickson Street.
I pretty well quit gong to Dickson three years ago because it didn’t welcome local commece. It had become a tourist trap rather than a cultural attraction.
If I have to pay for parking to enjoy the ambiance of frat boys and overpriced food and drink offered by corporate vendors — I will pass completely.
Fayetteville ain’t funky anymore — it’s a cash-hog. Woo Pig Sooie!
By burgerboy on December 4th, 2009
I love how Matthew Petty is talking to his ’shrooms.
That said, Matt Petty, agree with him or disagree, does show a good grasp of the issues brought before the city council. Watch the meetings and you will see. There are some members who take longer just to understand the issues themselves. Matt gets it, and tries to find solutions. You just may or may not agree with his solution to the problems.
He’s an asset to the city council, for sure.
By Andrew on December 5th, 2009
i cant even begin to address all the things that were wrong in the above statements.
I will only address the 2 most ridiculous ones:
1) If you have ANY SENSE of city planning, you would know that vertical cities end up costing more and falling apart faster than horizontal cities. PLEASE think before you talk. and city planners thinking parking decks are the solution should be fired.
2) The only reason Dickson ST is what it is, is because people can park close and for free. There is nothing special about it otherwise. There is nothing there that cannot be replaced (ask the WAC).
By mpetty on December 5th, 2009
@Andrew – The burden of proof is on you when you make statements like that. When you can prove to me that urban sprawl is a better planning model than the 2025 Plan, I’ll start to listen.
Until then, I’ll stick with our nationally-recognized planning department’s philosophy that increasing density is the only way to approach population growth in any helpful way.
By burgerboy on December 6th, 2009
Wow, Dickson is about parking? There’s much more ample parking in other areas of town. Why doesn’t everybody hang out at the mall, then? There’s tons more parking there.
Silly Andrew, Dickson is what it is because it is the ANTITHESIS of a sprawl model. Its “real”, walkable, and that makes it unique, unfortunately. Every city in the nation is trying to duplicate what we have on Dickson Street in some manner or another. Areas where walkable, high density development exists, in most cases, are becoming or have become the most desireable areas of cities. Dallas’ uptown is a fine semi-local example. Compare prices per square foot there to what its going for in McKinney. Heck, even Plano Texas, once the model of urban sprawl and tract housing, has revitalized and expanded its small downtown on the eastern side of town, and built Legacy Town Center, which attempts to duplicate the streetscape and high density nature of its downtown area on the western side of the city.
Arguably Dallas’ most desireable suburb Southlake Texas has built a dense, walkable, Dickson-like downtown model from scratch, and its the most desireable area of the city for both residential and commercial space.
I’m amazed everytime I hear (or read) people suggesting that we should follow the planning model embraced by Springdale, which slips further and further behind the rest of NWA in property values, desireability and quality of life every single year…
It never ceases to amaze me, actually.
Lioneld Jordan loses more points with me, since his newest appointment to the Planning Commission appears to espouse the same views as “Andrew” and views mixed uses as “nostalgic but unrealistic”.
By Zapp Brannigan on December 6th, 2009
Burgerboy for City Council!
By Andrew on December 6th, 2009
mpetty, do your own homework. and when you ask someone to reference what they are saying, at least do the same. what award has fayetteville planning won? the best tax collection award? the most speed bumps per street? maybe the city that does not recycle? because when i drive to work every morning, and keep riding over the same POS streets, i think award-winning.
“burgerboy”, if you want to compare fayetteville and springdale, then we are in serious trouble. springdale is an industrial city that actually produces something of value to the state. i’m sure that when their city planners come together, they think of how to keep the hippies and hipsters happy and where to build the next bike trail with a drive thru starbucks.
By Mark_Landry on December 6th, 2009
I’ve been to Springdale. It is not good. The best thing to do in Springdale is go to Fayetteville.
I did see Springdale in a national publication once; it was an unlabeled photo showing an example of a city with crowding, sprawl, and visual pollution. The photo was unlabeled, but you could see the Springdale Motel sign in the background.
NOT a model city.
And I love the speed tables, although I miss the original signs that said “speed hump.” Those cracked me up. Those bumps are fun as hell on a bicycle, maybe even more fun than riding through the drive through at Starbucks.
@ Andrew- Really? hippies and hipsters? What was that supposed to mean? You might as well just come out on your porch and yell “damn kids, get off my lawn!”
By Andrew on December 7th, 2009
mark_landry, you’re alright. i would have gotten away with it if it werent for those damn kids.
keep bikin’
By mpetty on December 7th, 2009
@Andrew – As you wish, “City Plan 2025 won an American Planning Association state level award in 2006 and the Congress for the New Urbanism Charter Award for a Region and Metropolis Plan in 2007. It was also noted on the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency’s Best Practices list and cited by the Natural Resources Defense Council as one of the factors in ranking Fayetteville #6 in the smaller cities category as part of their Smarter Cities campaign.”
Also, did you just say Fayetteville brings nothing of value to the state? It is at the least an interesting thought-experiment; what would Arkansas be like if the University of Arkansas’s flagship campus had been built elsewhere?
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