A familiar voice was amplified through the speaker system inside City Hall Tuesday night when Dan Coody took to the podium during a regular meeting of the Fayetteville City Council.
He returned to City Hall Wednesday morning marking the first time we’ve seen him inside the building on consecutive days since he was Mayor of Fayetteville.
His agenda? It’s hard to say with certainty.
Coody, who held office for eight years before losing a re-election bid to Lioneld Jordan in 2008, told the Northwest Arkansas Times that his recently voiced concerns over a hot local topic aren’t politically motivated, so we’ll have to take him on his word that he’s simply a taxpayer worried about a multi-million dollar parking deck project.
Fair enough. After all, we are talking about a garage at least five stories tall that would likely become a part of Fayetteville’s downtown skyline.
Coody isn’t suggesting the deck plan to be scrapped, nor has he been very firm with an initial concern he said he had over the timing of Mayor Jordan’s financing plan.
Instead, Coody says the mayor’s self appointed parking deck committee is overlooking a prime location for the deck, one that he says would be closer to the Walton Arts Center, less expensive to build, offer more parking than the current favored plan and most surprisingly, it would be invisible.
“Of the three sites you’ve been given to choose from, West and Spring is the best,” said Coody, referring to the committee’s recent agreement that the existing lot across from Grub’s Bar & Grille is the best choice for building a deck.
“But there’s a fourth site that I really think should be considered for the longterm benefit of the community,” he said.
The location? Underneath the main Walton Arts Center parking lot at the corner of Dickson Street and West Avenue.
Coody said an underground level of parking could be built for much less than a normal subterranean structure due to the unique topography of the site which was originally lower than the current street level.
In fact, he said a similar plan was discussed 20 years ago when the Walton Arts Center was first built, but instead, the choice was made to fill the area in with dirt and build only one level of parking.
Coody estimated his plan would add about 270 spaces to the Dickson Street area as opposed to the 235 that a 300-space deck would add if built on the existing 65-space lot at Spring and West.
He also said the cost of his plan could be as much as half a million dollars less than Jordan’s plan.
Mayor Jordan has said multiple times that he would not consider putting a deck in the main Walton Arts Center lot. “It’s not going to happen,” said Jordan in September at the parking deck committee’s first meeting. “We’re floating bonds on the (paid parking) revenue stream and when you start cutting that thing in half, you’re going to lose a lot of revenue.”
Fayetteville Chamber of Commerce President Steve Clark, who also serves on the mayor’s deck committee, said that while the group should be open to all proposals, it needs to consider the impact each plan would have on the parking situation during construction. “For the businesses in the entertainment district, a year without a lot of parking would be–it just would not work,” said Clark.
Half a mil less and no eyesore? This is the best option hands-down. Downtown can stand to do without the spaces for the duration of construction. The means most definitely justify the end here.
or rather, the end justifies the means – ha. Why isn’t this being seriously considered?
That anyone would consider taking advice from Dan Coody on public works projects in beyond belief. How many millions did we pay in cost overruns on the west side sewer plant–about seventy? Remember the last improvement project on Dickson? How many businesses and how much tax revenue did we lose during that debacle? Where does he propose the income on which we would issue and finance these bonds would accrue during construction?
And there is no political motivation?
Uh-huh.
Well, honestly, we sold bonds based on consultant’s COST ESTIMATES that were generated before I was in office to overhaul the sewer system. When we got the actual hard bids (which were much higher than the estimates), approved the additional money, and completed the job, the project came in on time and $7 million under the bid price (all documented). I know that conflicts with perception. I am still really disappointed with the Renaissance Tower and really want to see that property cleaned up some more. A least the Mountain Inn is gone.
Dickson Street? Yep, I inherited that project and had to fire project managers in the middle of the job, bring project management in-house (all documented), and I think it looks a lot better today. It needs maintenance. Other projects during my administration? The trail system, Fay. Public Library, College Ave, Square, Senior Center, 3 Fire Stations, Botanical Gardens, Mount Sequoyah Woods, 200 acres of parkland at no cost, etc. (all of which were underway simultaneously with the enormous sewer system overhaul) worked out pretty well. If you could go back in time, which of those would you stop?
To be fair, why single me out for “political motivation”? It seems more constructive to question the merits of proposals to facilitate additional parking without building a low-budget, 6-story parking garage in the heart of our beautiful downtown.
Compared to Coody, the current administration is like something out of a bad comic strip.
Perception sometimes really is reality and numbers don’t lie, Mr. Coody. There has been much discussion for many years about the cost overrun of the sewer plant, and never once has there been any indication that it came in under budget. To the contrary.
Are you seriously trying to take credit for all of those things and responsibility for nothing? Are you minimizing the work of council members, voters, volunteer groups, and donors in spearheading many of those projects, particularly the Public Library, Sequoyah Woods, the Botanical Gardens, and the trail system? Wasn’t the economy a whole different animal then and yet didn’t you spend reserves in addition to revenue? Don’t forget the speed bumps. If I had my druthers, those wouldn’t be there. Nor would those weird separator things on Gregg and on College. I’d rather still have the possibly reparable and architecturally interesting Mountain Inn than a privately owned paid parking lot and the damaged gray backs of buildings and nobody misses that crane or the hole. Not impressed with the College Avenue stuff either. It isn’t cohesive, the trees are too close to the road, and the lights are incongruent, all in all slapdash. Not a great value for the cost and inconvenience. I seem to recall a bit of a dust up about the Senior Center as well. And instead of having the Boys and Girls Club at Walker Park it’s across town and effectively inaccessible to many of the kids who could’ve benefitted from it’s services. And, gee, didn’t that Wilson Springs thing turn out well? About as well as SouthPass and Ruskin Heights and the Legacy Building and the Divinity and the Renaissance and the city-owned Mexican Original building…how much did we spend on infrastructure for all that?
Thanks for reminding me of so many reasons we’re lucky to have a steadier hand at the wheel.
Obvious Jordan Administration Troll is Obvious.
Steadier hand? AYFSM?
This city has seemed to be without leadership for the last three years.
All of the things you insist Dan Coody did not achieve would have never happened without his guidance.
Coody’s legacy is the things he mentioned. Jordan/Marr’s will be paid parking and an ugly garage and not much else.
If troll means supporter, yeah, “Obvious”ly I am. Not paid, not encouraged,not prodded. Just from the gut supportive. If it means I have vivid and valid memories of multiple not so shiny and wonderful details about Mr. Coody’s tenure–guilty as charged. Doesn’t make the facts any less true though, does it?
O.K. But do you think a 6-story parking garage is a good idea or a bad idea, and why?
I haven’t heard anyone say that a six story structure is even being discussed. Seems a lot of upset is being stirred up unnecessarily based upon alarmist false pretense. I do think a parking deck is needed. I trust the committee to make solid, well thought out recommendations, for the council and staff and administraion to thoughtfully consider those recommendations and for the public’s input to be solicited and respected. That’s how this administration works.
Case in point, the many, many public meetings before the current system was implemented and the scheduled public, council, and administration review and tweaking done after a set trial time.
Mr. Coody, I was pleased when you first posted here and shared your alternative suggestion, but you have now reverted to the tedious self-aggrandizement that marked your years in office. No one is interested in hearing that.
Yeah, my wife thinks I talk too much, too. So, what is your opinion on the idea of paid parking/need for parking/parking deck location? What do others think who you talk with?
I think there is now and will be in the future a need for more parking in the Dickson Street area. I wish people would choose other means of transportation instead of driving everywhere, but that is slow in coming. I think those choosing to park their cars should pay for the parking facilities. Neither I nor anyone I know wants an ugly deck, but there are some nice examples of esthetically pleasing structures, including one that you linked earlier. I am not an architect nor an engineer, so I’ll leave the specific site and design to those who are, instead of pretending to know it all. I am interested in hearing the discussion about what people would like to see, which can be done without bragging on themselves or attacking other people. That’s all.
Ummm, doesn’t Mr. Coody (or anyone) remember that there is basically an underground river under that lot? That’s why there’s that ‘grotto’ there at the entrance. It got covered over and the area filled when the WAC and that lot were built. But it is still there. Or we could, of course, just ignore inconvenient facts. Let the spin doctoring commence.
jmo
Old photos show substantial underground creek. EPA/DPCE docs. (now as edited or buried as the creek?) showed part of West St. on a preliminary Superfund site list around the time WAC was built. Is there a photo somewhere of the really big corroded underground storage tank lifted out of the West /Spring lot? Where did the ground around the creek go? Exquisitely tasteful p.c. design and expert obfuscation rule now as ever. There comes a moment when nature’s been so completely re-engineered and stifled that fine points of construction design and placement are irrelevant.
Another problem with putting the parking garage below grade at that location is ensuring that any surrounding retail spaces meet ADA requirements. (There would be retail on the street fronts, I hope.) Setting the garage low enough to have entrances at sidewalk level puts the parking far enough below grade to be on or in the water table in some areas, and would require quite a bit of loss of floor area for ventilation shafts and equipment. Otherwise, ramps and elevated walks with their railings take up a lot of ground space and separate retailers physically and visually from foot traffic.
I think the better solution is ground-level-and-up parking with lovely and engaging architectural features (Mr. Coody provided a great link to some fine examples in another thread), and unencumbered retail on the street. Let natural air movement ventilate the parking, go up that much higher, and have a platform/patio on top to rent out for parties and special events.
I normally have great distaste for automobile-centric planning, but in this case, the intersection of Dickson and West needs some bulking up to balance the Walton Arts Center and the brew pub. As long as the importance of pedestrians is respected, a relatively large parking garage with adequate, meaningful retail spaces need not present a problem.
Some good points. However, the creek underneath is already in a box culvert. Retail around the edge? Good idea, but the admin. has said that the lot should be left as it is forever for BBBQ (except for that hotel?). Shoot at the idea of a hidden parking facility all you want and see how you like a 6 story parking garage with no liner buildings on the next block. Want “compatibility” for a low-budget, 6-story garage? Choose from the following: the back of the WAC or Hillcrest Towers. Since people do not like to park in tall, tight parking garages, the odds are we will have another underutilized garage, $6 million if new debt, and still have a parking issue.
Another option? Plan for a parking deck built in conjunction with the WAC 600 seat expansion so that the deck is hidden by the hall and new offices.
I am sure some of you will think any other option besides a low-budget, 6-story garage is not worthy of consideration. Look at Google Earth and see how big a 6-story garage at Spring and West compares to the WAC or Underwood’s building, at roughly the same height. If some of you want to live with a permanent eyesore, that’s your right, and, honestly, you are very likely going to win. But I am going to exercise my right of free speech in support of something better.
Dan makes some good points and it makes more sense than anything that financial wreck Don Marr has his hands on, I mean come on making over $4500 biweekly and having to have his wages garnished at the city for a $6000 debt?
Dan, that 600 seat expansion is never going to happen, you and I both know it. Once the new one opens in Bentonville, they will abandon this idea.
I do not know that and I am still optimistic that it will be built, but I don’t think it will be soon. No doubt Bentonville is kicking our collective butt on infrastructure and downtown improvements and getting ready for new hospitality, tourism business coming because of the new museum. I doubt they would institute a paid parking program, but if they do, I can imagine it won’t be like ours.
Again, lots of conflicting stuff coming out of the Mayor’s office.
No building on the WAC lot, except that Mayor Jordan announced some hotel idea, even detailing a number of parking spaces that would be affected, not even two months ago.
Of course that person has since disappeared. So it seems Jordan announced hotel plans after only a few preliminary conversations.
Mr. Coody–
RE “Shoot at the idea of a hidden parking facility all you want and see how you like a 6 story parking garage with no liner buildings on the next block. Want “compatibility” for a low-budget, 6-story garage?”
There is enough room on the WAC lot to build a deck with a larger footprint than would dictate a six-story deck. Even with a retail perimeter at ground level, a three- or four-story deck could probably be quite serviceable. Given the floor-to-floor heights of a typical parking garage, the floor-to-floor heights of the brew pub and the height of the fly tower at the WAC, compatibility of massing should not be an issue. A deck with an adequate footprint would not be much of an encumbrance to BB&BBQ or other festivals.. Depending on the configuration of the ramps, the top surface of a parking deck is moderately to eminently useful as a public assembly space. A parking deck might well serve smaller festivals better than the whole lot does.
Also note that I didn’t suggest that the garage be “low-budget” in the sense that you appear to use the word. I– and you, for that matter– suggested that the garage be visually appealing.
The only thing that large surface parking lots are compatible with is places that people do not want to be in. The Dickson Street area should not be one of those places.
You are right in that liner buildings would be a welcome addition. Even with them, it is still preferable to go down one level and have the second level at-grade, and liners would be excellent. If there were a political will to do that, I would be all for it. You make a very good point, indeed, and i agree with you. I am only trying to offer a way of addressing this parking issue without having a huge garage unnecessarily driven into our downtown. I have no corner on concepts. I like your vision better than mine, I just don’t think there is the political will to consider it. And remember that the admin stated that the lot had to be left open for BBBBQ or could not be touched because of the revenue stream. That kinda puts a damper on any real creative concepts for that lot.
As a matter of fact, what you describe is similar to what was being considered 5 years ago, except the concept was to have the major WAC expansion, liner buildings and a parking deck all built as one unit on that 2.25 acre lot. We had a very large company that did municipal projects for a living discuss options with us for months until the Council stated that we did not need to be in the parking business. That’s when it fell apart.
The City has no money to build the retail or residential space (liner buildings) so we would need to partner with a private outfit to build and manage the spaces. If I thought there was a chance of doing that I would pursue it. At least, if we just build a lower level deck and an at-grade deck, it would ultimately be no worse than it is now. Now a 6-story garage? I can’t see that adding any appeal to downtown.
“If I thought there was a chance of doing that I would pursue it.”
In what manner or capacity, Mr. Coody?
By presenting another option that I believe makes more sense and hoping others consider it. T, what is your perspective on the parking garage? Is the idea of a 6-story parking garage a good one or a bad one, and why?
No, I really do not like the idea of a 6 story garage in downtown. To paraphrase what you stated in a separate post, that is a major addition to our skyline, and once it’s done, it can’t be undone. I’m not crazy about the notion of an underground garage either, but that’s more of a personal issue…the feel would be too claustrophobic. ;-) Anyway, as several others have suggested, I feel the best solution would be to convert the existing lot in a phased project.
I gotta say, I agree with Dan here. The underground lot could be done in phases, where only half of the parking lot is affected at any time. Build essentially two separate underground sections with their own exists, sort of how the current lots are configured.
You add 300 spaces, and you don’t add an eyesore. And perhaps with that extra million dollars you could put in some nice liner buildings along Dickson or West Avenue.
The pay parking has greatly diminished the immediate need for parking. I never have a problem finding a spot downtown anymore.
I think we can slow down here and let other ideas in.
Afterall, didn’t Jordan campaign on his administration being “The People’s Seat”?
Seems like that went out the window long ago….
*exits.
I don’t understand why it can’t be built over the existing parking lot behind Brew Pub/Common Grounds/Joses and the Legacy building. A long winding parking garage would only have to be two maybe three stories tall and should be rather well hidden when walking/driving along Dickson Street.
Are we really still arguing about parking in the Dickson area?? i think we need to be more concerned with how we keep getting taxpayers to visit Dickson St. —Dan Coody,,,,you did good things for the city of Fayetteville! Don’t let these naysayers get at you, Politics is an evil life regardless
Thanks for the kind words. I sure don’t have all the answers, but I think a broader public dialogue is needed in this case.
Dan
Where are you getting 6 stories from?
When you announcing your campaign for Mayor?
Well, I was assuming ( always dangerous) that the city would want to maintain some greenspace or tree canopy which would make the footprint even smaller. Also, there are no setbacks from the historic homes surrounding the site. Given the inefficiency of the lot shape (130x 240), taking out for elevators, stairs, ramps, columns, etc., if they build out to the max 300 new spaces could easily be done in 5 stories, but it would take a parking garage designer to make it work. Certainly 5 is better than 6. I still think there are better alternatives that need to be explored. If it turns out that this is the best spot after a thorough comparison, we will actually know that going in. Right now, we don’t.
It’s funny, but understandable, that people view my interest in this as politically motivated. The only parking garages I’ve seen that don’t detract form the fabric of a community are wrapped with liner buildings or hidden by art, (click on link below to see Cal. artist, Ned Kahn) (see his work in Charlotte, N.C., Wind Arbor at Gateway Village)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiS3m3SU2HE
or hidden by topography, none of which is going to happen here. I just worry that this parking garage is going to undermine the attractiveness of the downtown area and that it is irreversible. I just felt the need to speak up.
Those last posts were from me. Sorry. Have a good weekend to everyone.
Mr. Coody–
RE “it would take a parking garage designer to make it work.”
Isn’t hiring one part of the plan? I hope so– there’s little worse than a badly-planned parking garage.
RE “hidden by topography, none of which is going to happen here.”
One thing to consider is that a parking garage– even a six-story one in the Spring/West location is going to be masked in terms of mass by Hillcrest Towers when viewed from the north, until you get within about half a block of it on West Street. (You can verify that on Google Street View.) Not topography, exactly, though the hill rises quite a bit behind that lot.
This is not to say that the Spring/West lot is the best location for a parking garage. I think the dispersion of traffic could be a little more rapid from the Dickson/West location, because traffic could exit westward (getting out of the area quickly) and eastward on Dickson (taking advantage of both cycles of the signal at Dickson and West) and northward and southward onto West. Exiting onto Spring Street instead of Dickson Street would, I think, slow things down quite a bit. (Exiting time for a garage on the south side of the WAC property would probably fall between the two.)
RE “It’s funny, but understandable, that people view my interest in this as politically motivated….I just worry that this parking garage is going to undermine the attractiveness of the downtown area…”
Indeed. I seem to remember that when people expressed the same concern (or similar concerns) when you were the mayor, you dismissed it as politically motivated. For a person who has first-hand experience at being ragged on as mayor, and who considered quite a bit of public input to be sniping, you appear to do quite a bit of ragging and sniping. Of course, that could be one of the drawbacks of having a public profile even when you don’t have the public, and you are certainly under no obligation to at least give the impression of being more helpful.
Hey, David. Dismiss me with your usual condescension all you like but this is the only discussion about an alternative parking garage location anyone is having. I do appreciate Brian Swain’s public discussion of the financing plan. There have been a few folks who seem genuinely interested in debating a better outcome for downtown. They have legitimate concerns and questions. Wouldn’t it be great if they were addressed? There may be some good thoughts out there.
This is not a competition between myself and anyone else. I think Brian Swain’s perspective on location is the best one yet. I don’t wish for his thoughts to be ignored, too.
The first part of your post seemed thoughtful and provocative, although I am not sure I would rely on Hillcrest Towers to soften the blow.
Mr. Coody–
I’m not dismissing or ignoring you or anybody else. Your discussion of the parking garage is useful– so useful, in fact, that there is TV news coverage of it– and here at least it has been relatively low-key as far as political motivation is concerned. That has not always been the case, however. Your possible political motivation has been mentioned a couple of times in this and the related threads, as well as in others, and you saw fit to address it here yourself. Apparently, then, even you might see a need to tread more carefully. Calm down a bit and think about it.
I have agreed with your basic point that the West/Dickson corner is the best location for a parking deck. I have agreed with you that a parking garage can and should be lovely. I have not disagreed with Mr. Swain; his analysis is quite good. My pointing out that the concern of building mass at the Spring/West location is mitigated by Hillcrest Towers, and the floor levels of a parking structure in relation to subterranean water and ADA requirements, are in no way a dismissal of anything you have said, and there is no reason for you to get defensive because I have added factual information to be considered in the discussion.
RE “your usual condescension”
Oh, now– that just sounds huffy, which is a good way to earn some condescension.
RE “The first part of your post seemed thoughtful and provocative”
Thank you. If I didn’t think this discussion is worth having, I wouldn’t participate. As I said, it’s a good discussion, and believe it or not, I want it to be a good one. Unfortunately, the issue of political motivation is a distraction that keeps coming up.
One point that is being misconstrued is that a deck with 5 levels would be as tall as a 5 story building- this is simply not true. The city deck east of the Cosmo is a 3 level deck but is shorter than a 2 story office building. Just some perspective.
Here are the links that Mr. Coody posted under earlier articles on the parking garage redux:
http://nedkahn.com/wind.html#fragmentedDunes
http://youtu.be/DiS3m3SU2HE
Here is a link to an article specifically about parking garages:
http://www.thecoolist.com/parking-garage-design-10-modernist-masterpieces/
The first example might well be of interest to those who remember the discussion here some while back on the subject of automated parking structures.
Anyone ever thought of moving the so-called entertainment district of Fayetteville? Dickson St and the surrounds are a poor place for it. It’s cramped. There’s poor access. Dickson St has been funky since the 60s-70s and turning into a developers’ canyon is going to make it a very dismal place.
Perhaps move it to South 71. Wide open spaces, better access from MLK Blvd/I540. Developers could make a bundle! They would become “job creators.” Think outside the box. Fayetteville has no deep pockets to support the WAC. Corporateville has moved to Vendorville, Benton County.
I live a block and a bit north of Dickson and spend most of my time around this area. Other than Thu/Fri/Sat nights when school is in Fall or Spring semester and WAC/Hogs/BBBBBBBBBBBBBQ, the parking lots and street-level spaces are empty, empty, empty. The Underwood/Dickson building lot: empty. The lot attached to the United Methodist Church: empty. Even the WAC lot sits mostly empty during 85% of the week.
Why do we even need another parking deck? Who is parking here and for what? For the few D-level shows we have at the WAC? Considering Fayetteville’s population and who the main patrons of Dickson are, a parking deck that will sit empty most of the time seems extremely wasteful of both money and urban space. I truly don’t understand the obsession with more parking when you can find parking in the area most of the time.
I too am waiting for solid reasons that this parking structure is needed. I hope that the municipal bonds needed to build it aren’t being exploited as potential safe-investments for all the big money looking for higher interest. That would be a bad thing, to build an unneeded deck just to sell muni-bonds and provide employment for contractors.
If Blarrrgh’s comments are true and no parking is necessary Sunday through Wed. nights the cost analysis to determine the payback of a new parking lot should take that information into consideration. We visit Dickson often and usually have very difficult time finding parking on the weekend. Unless the WAC has an event we find a spot with no difficulty during the week, however when the WAC has something going on we find parking to be scarce.
I have noticed that many suggest using the Underwood space for parking. I believe it is currently available for parking and I have found it full on weekends. I imagine that when the condo’s and hotel planned for the Dickson (formerly Underwood Plaza) need parking space it will be not be available for public parking.
If many or all of the spaces are filled on weekends potential entertainment district customers will go elsewhere. That is probably why many businesses supported paid parking- because of the promise for more parking availability.
Interest rates are very low now. If Fayetteville plans to borrow now would be the time. The bond interest rate will be at the appropriate market rate. That is low now. One other comment. Many believe that projects that will help people work is a good thing. If we employ workers to build a parking deck ( that a cost analysis should support) wouldn’t that be a good thing?